Paddlewheel Position

[kiwimodeller]

Hi, can anybody give me some ideas or formulas for working out where on the hull the paddlewheel shaft of a sidewheeler should be mounted? I have a friend with a Kingston Mouldings hull of Yarta, a nice steam launch design and I am trying to persuade him to sell it to me for a bargain price or build it in to a paddler himself. We have no idea where the paddle shaft should be mounted, either along the length of the hull or how high to put it. Should the wheels be at the centre of the hull length? How much of the wheel should be below the waterline? We are thinking of using Graupner wheels but do not have them yet, does anybody know what the O.D. of them is? Thanks, Ian.

[derekwarner_decoy]

Hi PD's - goodness Ian, you are asking more questions than Pandora has .....[ANSWERS]   for

Without researching the "Kingston Mouldings hull of Yarta" ... life could be difficult & sometimes a little self help is needed :idea:  :arrow:  :arrow:

Possibly best for you to look @ snaps of different vessels & then consider which could or would suit the hull..... if the hull is the essential point

From my heart found+dumb founded experience gained over the 5 years I could only recommend to you ...... "build a paddler based upon a plan" - not necessarily a kit, but a proven plan which by default has a "start date & a finish date embedded within the 10,000 odd hours of saw dust+glue+planks+radio control+steam bits & pieces if chosen+lonely nights+cold cups of"  : ..............Derek

[Walter Snowdon]

Unless the paddler was designed in the very early period when paddles were well forward due to the hulls being designed on sailing ship lines (where the hull is fullest well forward (called the cods head, mackerels tail theory of water flow) , the vast majority of paddles were halfway along the hull or just slightly forward. ( Have a look at all the plans in the plans section of PD).I personaly feel that putting them slightly forward gives a much more balanced look,
Also, make a card and yoghurt pot-top mock-up of the sponsons and paddle boxes selotaped together at the side of the hull. Play around with positions and sizes of the box and sponsons. Dont skimp on the sponsons as their shape adds to the beauty of a paddler. I havnt seen this particular hull, is it clipper bowed?. if so, there are several clyde steamers which could be adapted and a lot of the Swiss steamer could be used as a base. More to follow as this particular thread expands!  Regards, Walter.

[Walter Snowdon]

Have you given any thought to using the plan of YARTA as a basis for a Windermere-style paddler-launch? It could be quite atractive and unusual.
Paddle shafts are normaly at main deck level or slightly above for ease of maintainance, usualy with a domed or step over cover. How long is the hull?.  The graupner wheels can be reduced in diameter by removing the outer rim, which makes them quite practical. (I think it was Mick who did a strand on this method in a previous paddleduck strand). Can you confirm this Mick?.
 Have a look at my paddle launch Melissa in the Clubs section of PD under Paddleducks get together. This started life as a 29inch tug hull adapted with the minimum of work into quite an atractive looking paddler. A longer steam launch with a bigger cabin would look even better. How about being the first PD to do this/.  Regards, Walter.

[Walter Snowdon]

Ian, the article on modiying Graupner wheel to reduce diameter was by EDDY and can be found under... you guessed it- the PADDLEWHEELS section of this site! Regards, Walter.

[mjt60a]

No, I didn't ever mention removing the outer rim from a graupner paddlewheel....
The way I'd set up a paddlewheel is as follows;
position the wheel so one float is at it's lowest possible position, then the floats either side should be just covered by water (ie, just below the waterline) in other words, either hold the wheel against the hull and mark the centre or, better, measure the distance on the wheel from the top of 'an imaginary line between the top edges of the two floats either side of the lowest' and the wheel centre,  and mark this same distance on the hull, above the waterline.....
does that make any sense at all???
Its not at all scientific and probably not correct but works for me  :roll:

As for whether the shaft should be central, forward or aft of centre (when viewed from the side)... I don't really know but on pictures of ships and boats it often appears that if the boiler is forward of the engine (as in most cases), the paddleshaft is slightly aft of centre, if the engine is forward of the boiler (tattershall castle, menna, various tugs...) the shaft is forward of centre...
That's just an observation - and I haven't seen that many pictures 'side on' of paddlers to make a real judgement. Maybe someone with many plans of different types of vessel could confirm or disprove that!

[kiwimodeller]

Thanks all, I will now download a few plans and print them and compare with the very basic Yarta plan that we have.
( http://www.kingstonmouldings.com/pdyartasteamyacht.htm).
 She is a 45" clipper bow/counter stern steam launch with bowsprit, built in 1889. Single funnel and small cabins. She would make a lovely screw powered launch if built to plan but I already have one of those and have yet to find a paddler kit of this sort of era which is the style I like. And yes I ask lots of questions Derek - the idea being to not have to spent hundreds of hours changing things to fix the stuff-ups I could have avoided by using the experience of those who have been there - done that!
When I try and figure things out for myself I rapidly get reminded of my father's favourite saying -"Every time I think I see the light at the end of the tunnel it turns out to be some bastard with a train trying to run me down!" :twisted:

[Broder Incertus]

Unless the paddler was designed in the very early period when paddles were well forward due to the hulls being designed on sailing ship lines (where the hull is fullest well forward (called the cods head, mackerels tail theory of water flow) , the vast majority of paddles were halfway along the hull or just slightly forward. ( Have a look at all the plans in the plans section of PD).I personaly feel that putting them slightly forward gives a much more balanced look,
[…]  Regards, Walter.

I seem to remember reading something about the paddle wheels being positioned at the crest of the bow wave (at cruising speed, I guess). Does this make any sense?

/tm