Interesting Picture of Princess Elizabeth

[charvey4875]

Hello PD's

I am not sure if the Photo Ship website http://www.photoship.co.uk has come up before in discussions, but it has some interesting photos on it, and well worth a look.

This picture appeared on e-bay a while ago, I unfortunately missed the auction, luckily the picture has now appeared on Photo Ship.

http://www.photoship.co.uk/JAlbum/Old%20Ship%20Picture%20Gallery%20K-P/P/slides/Princess%20Elizabeth-07.html

The picture shows PS Princess Elizabeth after her refit, post war service, (she returned to Southampton sometime in 1944). I think this picture appears to show her in wartime grey (other solent steamers were painted simularly during the war period according to the book "ISLE OF WIGHT HERE WE COME", The story of the SR's Isle of Wight ships during the war 1939-1945 by Hugh J. Compton)

Does anyone know if what I am thinking is likely? or can anyone shed any more light on this photo, and / or date, or location?

This reasearch malarkey is good fun! :-)

Thanks

Chris

[Walter Snowdon]

A very interesting photograph. This is not her wartime condition. If you look, the funnel is a darker tone, probably red and her wartime upper bridge has been removed and all vestiges of her gun mountings have been removed. I think, looking at the large rust patches, this may have been taken after her withdrawal from service and just prior to her going to France. So why the colour change to (white?) after leaving service. I will have to start going through my cuttings etc again!. Thanks, walter.

[charvey4875]

Hi Walter,
Thanks for the reply, and a very interesting point. There is a picture in Russell Plummers recent article in Ships Monthly (August 2007 if memory serves, I have my notes with me but am not at home at the moment) which is captioned something like "With Balmoral at Husbands yard in 1969".  This shows Princess Elizabeth with only one mast (the foremast), in a rather grubby looking light colour over her stern quarter.

I had made the assumption that the photo on Photo Ship was taken between 1944 which is when I believe she was returned to Southamption, but after her refit, and 1954 when the main mast was fitted to comply with the new nav lighting regulations.

The information I have for her in the period you are talking about is:

1966
Sold to A.W Render with a plan to use PSPE as a casino
1967
Sold for scrap to Metrix Ltd, Newhaven
Sold to Ferry Services & Supplies Ltd., Woolston, Southampton
Arrived Southampton 24th October 1967
Engines and equipment removed
1968
Sold to H. Butler
Towed to Northney Yacht Marina, Hayling Island
1969
Sold to Don Hickman
1970’s
Moved to London
3rd June 1970 Opened as a restaurant at St Katharine’s Pier below Tower Bridge.
During 1973, she was moved up to Old Swan Pier under London Bridge.
1980’s
In 1987 Princess Elizabeth was taken to Gravesend to become a yacht club headquarters.  This plan never came into fruition.

Princess Elizabeth was then brought by the French typographical group Association de Defenses des Arts Typographiques (ADAT)  as the first museum of typographical art. Part of the ship was to be reserved for exhibiting details of her own remarkable history. In the December of 1987 Princess Elizabeth was moved under tow to Rouen on the Seine. Bad weather en-route forced a call to take shelter at Dover, the first visit by Princess Elizabeth since her days in the 10th Minesweeping Flotilla during World War II.  
 
There is a photo of this, but she is in a rather sorry state, with no bridge or masts.

ADAT moved Princess Elizabeth again to the Pont Mirabeau in Paris in 1991 and opened the museum of typographical art at after nearly two years of restoration at Rouen. She stayed on the Seine in Paris until the late 1990’s.

Thanks again

Chris

[Walter Snowdon]

Curiouser and curiouser. I see she has only one mast and all ships boats are removed.After her sevice as an anti aircraft ship she was refitted and went back into  service (red Funnel).In 1954 she was fitted with a mAst behind the funnel to fit in with navigation regulations.

In 1959 she was sold to Torbay steamers and operated from Torquay in 1960 and  1961.

in 1962 Company changed name to Coastal steamers and Marine sevices Ltd operating out ofBrighton and Weymouth 1962-65.

In 1966 She became a Casino (A>W>RENDER) but never opened as such.
In 1967 she was sold to METREX Ltd and resold to Ferry Services and Supplies Ltd. when all eqipment and engines were removed.

In 1968 Sold to H.Butler and towed to Northney Yacht Marina Hayling Island as a marina HQ.

In 1969 sold to Don Hickman.

In1970 went to London as a restaurant near London Bridge where she changed hands several times.

I never saw her after Red Funnel service and my bet is that when she was a Marina clubhouse or a restaurant she was painted white. Any takers or better still did anyone see her during this period or better still, any photos! Regards, Walter.

[charvey4875]

Hi Walter,
I think we must have posted at amost the exact same time! Many thanks for the information.

I have had another thought about this - The bridge and wheelhouse was extended sometime prior to her return to service in 1946, the wheelhouse and bridge are flush with the main superstructure after this date
http://www.plimsoll.org/resources/WorldShipSociety/25745.asp
whereas previously the bridge was stepped back from the front of the superstructure.  In late 1937 or 1938 a small wheelhouse was fitted http://www.plimsoll.org/resources/SCCMuseums/18698.asp

I had always thought (again another slight assumption) that she went to war with the smaller wheelhouse, the larger one only being fitted for her return to service. I have only seen this picture of her on war service http://www.megoran.fsworld.co.uk/Princess%20Elizabeth.htm

Anyway there is another not unrelated question brewing, which is illustrated by the first picture on the last website mentioned, the bridge and wheelhouse are a dark colour, is this varnished wood, or painted, or painted and grained? The info I have shows that the bridge and wheelhouse were both "dark" from 1946, but by the early '50's the bridge windshield (dont know the technical term) was cream, and the wheelhouse was brown, as illustrated by the third picture from the bottom.  I also dont know when this change was made!

Many thanks

Chris

[Walter Snowdon]

Hi Chris, this is becoming a very interesting thread! All the paddlers which were taken into war service had a bridge fitted if they didnt have one, and existing bridges recieved partial armouring, plus a flying bridge (open) built onto the bridge roofs. (Look at the previous mentioned wartime photo and you will see the flying bridge).
Several years ago when the PS Wingfield castle came to Hartlepool I helped with her restoration. On arival her bridge wings were covered in many layers of white paint which on removing exposed her lovely teak woodwork which we cleaned and oiled back to original. I think that post- war an awfull lot of woodwork was just covered in thick paint to save money and time on labour! Regards, walter.

[charvey4875]

Hi Walter,
Apologies for the delay in responding.

That is very interesting about all paddlers being fitted with bridges for war service.

Wingfield Castle certainly looks better to my eye with her bridge wings in a natural wood finish, rather than painted, well worth the effort.  Was any of the woodwork replaced during the restoration?

I have just been having another look through the information I have, and it looks like Gracie Fields was fitted with a very similar wheel house at approximately the same time as Princess Elizabeth.

Thanks

Chris